Sidney Eskenazi Final Podcast
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Hanna: [00:00:00] Welcome back to The Hustle by Hanna, where we go beyond the headlines to uncover the grit, generosity, and ground game behind extraordinary lives. Today's guest is Sydney Eskenazi, a man whose name is etched into the very fabric of Indiana. Born into hardship. Sid started working early and experienced that forged his legendary work ethic and sense of responsibility.
A chance encounter led to the creation of one of the world's largest property management organizations in the world. Later. He started his own firm only to be forced out by his partners. But what looked like a setback became the turning point. Sid used law and real estate to build sand or development now one of the largest privately held commercial real estate firms in the country.
With over 70 properties in 23 states and more than 8 million square feet under management. What truly defines Sid isn't just business success. It's what he's done with it. Sid and his wife Lois, have supported more than a hundred organizations, funded over 200 scholarships, and given millions of dollars to landmark donations across the state of Indiana.
This episode is about more than just giving back. It's about [00:01:00] living forward. Sid's story is one of early hustle, quiet resilience, and the legacy of lifting others up. At 95 years old, he's still working, he's still giving back, and he's still determined on building his legacy. Let's get into it.
Sid: I was born in 1930. I graduated from grade school, school 22, getting ready to go to Manel High School on Monday. I walked in the door and there was a man there. He said, I've got to tell you something. I said, what is it? He said, your father's dying 13 years old at that point. And I said, what can we do? He said, we can't do anything.
We need penicillin and civilians can't buy it. I don't know how to get it. He said he will die the day from Ham. So, so a few hours later I saw him again. He said, your father's passed away. Monday we would start sit Shiva for a week. A week later, I started Manuel High School. I needed a job and he agreed to put me on and let me [00:02:00] work every day after school, Saturdays, sometimes even Sundays.
And you paid me 25 cents an hour. In those days, a penny in and turned a crank, and if you're lucky, you got a little charm or something, that was to take that machine, empty it, clean it out real well. That's what I was earning, 25 cents. But I went to work every day. I liked working. It wasn't a hardship, I just didn't get good grades.
Hanna: Did you work because you had to, or genuinely because you wanted to? The government gave
Sid: us $17 per person Social Security. That was it. I had two sisters. Me and my mom apparently spoke English and. Every time I worked social Security would notify me that I had to pay back what I they'd given me previously.
Those were the rules. It was just the four of us living on Kansas Street in that house, and [00:03:00] I worked because everybody in our neighborhood were enjoyed being with people and learning and doing things and getting paid for it. But I had to get paid for it if I wanted any spending money of my own. In the beginning, I was the attorney for Melvin, Simon and Associates.
I set up the illegal work, all the documents to incorporate 'em. And what I learned for myself was later on, by watching what he did, how he did it, figuring I better do some of this myself. And I went after him telling him that he had agreed. That I was to participate in some of his ventures with him. And so far he hadn't done it.
And one day he came to me and said, okay, okay, you, you keep wanting to be involved. I'm going to do a Kmart and I'm gonna let you be a part of it. I said, what's a Kmart? He says, I don't know. He says, but it's something that the Kresge company was doing. I have no [00:04:00] idea. I said, what did they do? He says, they're discount store.
What's a discount store? I've never seen anything like that, but he didn't care and cost us a bunch. 1,000,002 to build it. We borrowed about a million dollars or or less to build it. We had a few dollars left over from the loan and that's what we got for our services. We split that. I got my half and E got half.
We went on to do another
Hanna: one. Was it extremely risky to do something like that? In the beginning
Sid: I went to the people I wanted to loan me money with a plan. They knew from having worked with Mel previously, that we knew what we were doing. 'cause I was in all of the meetings with the bank and so on and so forth.
And I explained to him exactly how we knew. We knew what our costs were. We knew what our rent was going to be. Now, could we make mistakes? Yes, of course you can. But we were lucky in the beginning and I was, uh, very [00:05:00] astute of what he did. And I watched what he did and I learned from him. I liked what I did too.
I like dealing with people. I still do. To this day, I will still help people if I can.
Hanna: What about after that first big deal with Mel and starting your own business?
Sid: She was going into building the huge malls, and that wasn't what I wanted to do. I wanted to build things and rent them out, own them, and get the income. So my family and I had money to live on. That's what I wanted to do. Uh, I didn't wanna build monuments.
I didn't want to sell everything that I. And I just wanted to make income so we could live decently. That's what I did. I probably was instrumental in building 15 or 18 Kmarts.
Hanna: Did you have to get a loan for that project? We always had to get a loan. And did people trust you? Well, 'cause of your experience with Mel,
Sid: I'd go back to the same banks that I worked with with Mel, and they knew that [00:06:00] I knew what I was doing and sometimes I would sit and talk to him about what.
They should be doing a little bit better. He came to me and told me that wanted me to understand there was no more room in the business for me. He was bringing in his family from New York and all of the people that he went to school with in New York. And I said, but you promised. He says, well, can't help it.
Wanna be our attorney? You can be our attorney. I now, I I, I have to have something where I know the money. I'll be there to help, pay me to help take care of my kids. I said, I'll just. Start all over again. That was a whole new, new way. I started a law firm all over again. I had partners in the law firm. It was not a very good experience.
Hanna: Was it a big shift and did you have to learn new skills for that?
Sid: Found people that I knew offered, offered them something that I hadn't been offered before. A full participation in what I was doing. The first thought I took in, I [00:07:00] said, I want to. That you have 25% of the business. Mm-hmm. Because everything in Harry's mind, books, the tables, everything.
It's all my stuff. We're all ready to keep going. And he said, well, I have a friend, uh, who's my closest friend. I, all right, I'll give him 25% too. That's 50% and I'll keep 50%, which I did. But as time went on. The first 25% it was okay. The second 25% person did not know what he was doing, how to run a law practice, how to get clients, how to charge.
They kept saying to me, they wanted me to keep giving out more of what I owned in the partnership because they brought in more people and they all wanted a piece of the deal and there's only a hundred percent of something. I was leaving the office one day on the end of the week, all of my partners.
He Stopped me at the back door and I I, what's going on? He says we have to talk to you. It's Friday afternoon, Uhhuh. How [00:08:00] about wait till Monday? Now you understand I've given away 80%. Of my business. It was my business. I started it. I kept it going. I also included some of, in what I was building, not all of them.
And you know, maybe, but there's only so much in a hundred percent. So we've had a partners meeting. Okay. I. And we want you out. I said, what do you mean you want me out Be out. We don't wanna be partners with you any longer. Wow. We want you outta here. I said, so you're going to take over the business that I've given you?
You're gonna start your own, all of you. And. You. You don't appreciate what I've done for you. No. We want you out, we want you out in a week. By next Friday we want you out. Well, I was pretty devastated. I said, there's only one problem. He said, what's that? I said, I own the building. Wow. You get out. They all left me with an empty building except for me and [00:09:00] my little cubby hall office, my books and stuff like that.
Hanna: Did that fuel you to build something bigger than before?
Sid: I had to start all over again.
Hanna: Exactly.
Sid: They walked out on me and, but luckily for me, I still had some clients in my law practice and I still had some stuff I was doing with the building I was doing, and I still didn't give all. All of it away. They made a big mistake saying that to me.
It was a terrible mistake on there for, but I'm glad they did it. Now that that's probably one of the really bad deals.
Hanna: What was the first big deal by yourself that you were really proud of?
Sid: What happened was we got married, we had nothing. Every time the Shortridge band would play in the morning real early, we would wake up.
'cause we had an efficiency apartment. I mean, it was just a bed in the corner. And a bathroom, and my wife was working at the IU Health [00:10:00] Center and I was trying to build up my practice, but living together in just one room all the time to get in the bathroom. Everything was there and got real bad when she wanted to bring somebody home from the office.
Where'd I vote? I did. They'd say, well, you can sit in the toilet room. And that was okay until somebody else wanted to use the toilet. Then I had to go sit in the hallway. It's just, this isn't going to work. I, I need to know what I'm doing. And so I decided to buy a house with three bedrooms, two bathrooms, full sized garage, big kitchen, big a lot, just absolutely.
Gorgeous. And I went to the builders and said, I wanna buy one of 'em, and how much is it? And he said, well, I'll sell you one. I think it was close to $25,000. I said, I'll, I'll buy it. I, I'm gonna have to get some money from the banks. I went to the bank. And I said to him, I need to borrow some money. Well, how much do you need to borrow?
[00:11:00] I said, oh, about 24,000. Well, you don't earn enough money. What do you mean I don't earn enough money? Mm-hmm. I think it was a hundred dollars a week that I had to have an income coming in to do this. I said, just hold on. I said, gimme a a week to see what I can do that on. Called him and said, you know what?
I've had the best thing happen to me. I said, I had a client that just put me on retainers for a hundred dollars a week. Always says now, always in,
Hanna: give you the loan.
Sid: I mean, lived there and loved it. Our first child was born and lived in that house.
Hanna: I'm sure you were very proud of that too. Being able to build something for your family and
Sid: well, uh, you know,
Hanna: it's your hard work paying off.
Are there any types of characteristics you think in building the business that aren't so obvious to everyone [00:12:00] else?
Sid: I try to teach people we've got to earn a profit just to, to, to, and make noise about how much money you're bringing in doesn't mean anything unless it's profitable. There's got to be something left for him to have and, and if it's not profitable, it's not worth it.
Going into, as far as I was concerned, we need to work to earn money, and we're still doing it today.
Hanna: Why do you do it better than your competitors? I
Sid: don't say I do. I also do, they can do what they do and they're thinking about going into the real estate business. What did I think? I always told 'em, there's plenty of room in this country for other people.
Call, jump in, get your feet wet.
Hanna: You're focused on your business and your success, and they can be focused on theirs, and you can both have success in your individual ways
Sid: as long as everything's. Honest and to treat people fairly. But, uh, I enjoy working. I still work every day.
Hanna: Well, what keeps you working every day today?
Sid: Well, am I going, do you watch tv?
Hanna: No. [00:13:00]
Sid: Come on now. That's not working.
Hanna: You've given what's known as the single largest donation in Indiana State history, a $40 million donation to create the Eskenazi Hospital. What was your first donation that you gave? I.
Sid: That first deal when we finished building it and closed the loan on it, we had money left over and we each took our halves and I was thinking about what I should do with the money I had, and I.
That was the first time I went to Indiana University to talk to 'em. I told them that I had this money, I wanted to do something. I wanted to help kids get through school with scholarships. It was a considerable amount of money. It was in excess of, I think 20, $25,000 each. Here's what we'll do with set up an endowment.
And make it so that we're going to help kids with scholarships, [00:14:00] but you can't spend everything. You can take the endowment, earn money with it, half of the money you earn, you have to put back into the endowment so it will grow. And the other half we can use to give scholarships to kids.
Hanna: You have Eskenazi Health, and you were just talking previously about a lot of your other philanthropic gifts.
Which one are you most proud of?
Sid: I think the husband, this husband will take care of many, many, many people. For a long period of time and keep 'em from saying hurts if I can help someone. Not say it hurts. I said, I feel very comfortable with that. I was just amazed at the way the place looks and it's clean and got all the people walking through there and you know they don't have much in the way.
It means, I don't know if you've ever experienced real pain, but that's all you think about. It hurts. It hurts. You don't want it to hurt. [00:15:00] I don't want anybody to have real pain, but you know, around the world where it will happen, there's pain out there and I'm grateful. Or having been picked to help with that hospital and to help people lessen their pain.
Hanna: That's incredible. I think more people need to give back. It's important. How do you help young people today if they come to you for advice, what type of advice do you give them to continue to keep going when times are troubled? Like now you
Sid: gotta tell 'em they've got to find things and learn to work it so that they can.
Do something that help their families and they also think somewhat about paying back. And we always preach that you gotta pay back a bit, uh, give back. You wanna give back. I'm a, a kid from the wrong side of Indianapolis, working in poor neighborhood with poor people and was always seeing some help my father and uncle.
Gave to [00:16:00] charity at times when during the depression, you're talking about how much did they give you? Give a quarter of 50 cents,
Hanna: but they always gave, which is important.
Sid: Always. There's no question about it. We always help people.
Hanna: What do you think is the best skill that young leaders, entrepreneurs can have today to find success?
Besides working hard and giving back, is there something else you see in young people that. You can point to and say they're gonna do well,
Sid: I'm tell you the secret. I'm asking you to pay me buy it or anything. I'm gonna give you the exact secret how you can be successful. You got learn to live the way your needs.
You cannot. Spend everything you want. Got to know how some of it for yourself, your family, and to help other.
Hanna: You've had the ability to give back and you've done it through the arts, you've done it with a hospital, you've done it with many mentorships and just being who you are. And I think that's something that everyone can look up [00:17:00] to.
It's not that
Sid: I was required to do or not because someone expected me. This is the help you shouldn't be doing. Whatever it is. You have to make sure I pick the right ones for me. May not be for you, but for me. And then I have one other thing. I get in trouble. I said I'm gonna go to my best friend and find out what to do.
You know where I go, I go right into the bathroom. You know why? 'cause there's a mirror there and I look in that mirror and I say to that person, this is the problem. What should I be doing today? Answer me pretty good and he answers me pretty good, or she, whatever. That mirror will not lie to me. Or tell me when, what I know in my heart I should be doing.
Hanna: It's trusting yourself and knowing that you're accountable for your own actions and your life.
Sid: I don't regret anything I've done. Have I made mistakes? Yes. Have I done something wrong? Yes. Have I tried to hurt anybody? [00:18:00] No. Could I have done something that might have made me hurt somebody? Maybe. That's life.
Hanna: Well, I think it's important to share experiences and true values that you've shared. I really do wanna thank you. I know we've done this before and I think it exemplifies that you are so willing to do interviews like this, and it's something that I hope
Sid: anytime I can or need something, or even if you have a little towel web in your head, quite know how to handle the problem.
Mm-hmm. I would be happy to help you. There's nothing involved with it. I mean, it's just two people talking. So you do the best you can with what you have and it's all you can do,
Hanna: and that's what we're gonna continue to do. You have an in an incredible legacy that I think anyone would be lucky to, well come in contact [00:19:00] with.